The Queen of China

(In my continued conversations with M. about her boyfriend J. 'disppearing' about 3 weeks ago, she's now questioning whether or not her decision to go off the market and become exclusive and being sexually active without knowing him better was a mistake.)

Pat says not to take yourself off the market WITHOUT A COMMITMENT--but you get to decide the level of what that commitment is. You were willing to date him exclusively because he verbalized that he might want to marry you. You took that risk. What Pat is talking about are the women who become girlfriends (forever) without men every having any thought of marriage as their future. Those women wait endlessly, or a man tells them from the beginning that he doesn't want to get married and they hang around for a couple of years hoping that he'll change his mind. So yes, Pat recommends dating until you find 3 number ones--any of which may ask for monogamy and take you off the market to become their wife.

Your monogamy was not premature--he asked for exclusivity, you accepted...different concept. You took a risk sleeping with him based on his words--and we watch a man's actions--anyone can say anything--from now on you may call me 'Her Majesty, the Queen of China'. Does that make me her? No.

(C. then came into the conversation privately...)

Fran I don't want to give the girls the impression that I am a married man chaser...but I just had the sweetest email from my mentor...he had mistakenly thought that he had offended me because details of a significant meeting had not gotten to me (my fault entirely because I am not yet plugged into the email system at work) until today...

It was just so funny and sensitive (talking about me as the princess and the pea and how esteemed I was ...). Then I thanked him for being thoughtful but reassured him that he was picking up on a tone in my emails which was due to the fact that I was a bit frazzled after a sleepless night (other work worries) and that it had indeed been as if I had slept on a mattress with a pea underneath...

(This is funny to me C. because I always liken myself to the Princess and the Pea. Have you read any of the material on 'highly sensitive' people? You might find the work interesting and revealing. Some years ago I was mentoring a guy in real estate and I fell in love with his daughter...he said to me that he couldn't 'take' her because all day long it was 'daddy, I'm hot', 'daddy, I'm cold', 'daddy ,I'm thirsty', 'daddy, I'm hungry'. All day long she voiced how she was to have her needs attended to...now that's MY child. I'm just like that. When I buy shoes I have to try on every pair in the store in my size to possibly get one 'right' shoe and one 'left' shoe that don't hurt in order to make to make a perfect pair.)

(We were once all together and she was complaining once that she had gotten a mosquito bite while we were out scouting properties and 'daddy' had said to her that he didn't have any 'itch medicine' with him. When we got back to my house I asked her if she was OK or if she still needed 'itch medicine'? My little indignant darling said 'no, I'm not OK', walked herself into my bathroom and promptly sat down showing me the exact spot on her leg that needed tending.)

My mentor then sent one of his customary jokey/jocular emails straight back just to get the balance back and be back in the driving seat..

I am learning so much about the way guys don't lead at all with their tenderest feelings ....

They do when they've fallen in love. But men also compartmentalize. Women always lead with their feelings; men do when they're not doing something else. Pat always says that men are far more sensitive than a woman could ever be. He may not lead with his feelings, but he knows how to manipulate them in YOU.

I do hope I can find someone in real life that I get on with as well as this guy. I have learned so much from the last year. In many ways, he has spoiled me for the next available guy I meet because he is exceptional. I also need to guard my heart this coming year at work.

That's the best we can hope for from any man--that he raises the bar higher in his treatment of you; to learn your value--and any man treating you 'less than' isn't worthy of your company.

Anyway, I will keep you posted of developments...

Please go back and read my blog "Phone Sex" you'll see how easy it is to be swept away when you're feeling vulnerable and the guy at the other end of the conversation is telling you everything that you've waited a lifetime to hear. It's been a lot of years since this one pulled at my heartstrings but every 6 months or so he still looks at my profile to let me know that he's thinking about me or wondering if I'm still available to come out and play with him. For me, there's only so much flirting that I want to do before I need it to be real; and if a guy isn't willing to make it real, I'm not going through the emotional masturbation of dancing the flirting dance without it progressing. It's an unfortunate state of affairs that we as woman have to wait to be asked, but when a man flirts but doesn't ask, by his inaction, we know his ultimate choice. The distilled reality is that anything other than a yes, is a no. There is only so long that a man can have my attention without his affection before I'm willing to move on to a man who IS willing to step up to the plate.

That situation with J. must have taken such a lot out of you!  A tough lesson indeed. Soulful, romantic words like that just go through your heart like butter...

The guy I work with is absolutely genuinely about who he is and has high ethical standards in his work and his general approach but... he is very clever politically indeed and has admitted as much to me that he knows how to work situations and people to get the best results. I think he really understands women and knows which metaphorical buttons to press and it is relatively easy for him. I know he has no intention of doing anything untoward with me; but I sense that what is for him 'light' flirting is for me much more costly.

He has occasionally told me he is a bit of a bastard. I asked him what he meant on the fifth occasion and he compared himself to a wily politician.

There are biological reasons why women love the bad boy bastards. I was reading an article about this yesterday regarding the nature/nurture dichotomy on this. The writer claimed that it was a combination of biology and women who had 'daddy issues'. I disagree; I believe they are one in the same.

Women like those type of men because without men who had the mindset to go toe to toe with an enemy; to 'step up and show me what you've got', as it were, both ourselves and our children died in their care.

Therefore, if a woman (like me) had a father who was more of a bad ass than not, who grew up in a house filled with macho men who were taught to behave the same way, then of course, the imprinting of 'this is how a man behaves' has her NEEDING those qualities in a man and nothing less will do.

On the other hand, lesser males who didn't have both the emotional and physical territorial boundaries who were not able to pass their genetic material forward died off by the hands of either beast or foe.

And then there is the growth and development of the fetus itself and how much estrogen is washed over the male/female child  based on the stress levels of the mother which will either masculinize or feminize the child--which is separate and aside from their physiological gender....but changes the development in critical thinking and body form. I.e. women who excel in typically male dominated fields such as engineering have had a greater testosterone bath in the womb. Men who's bodies have more breast tissue and a roundness from their waist to their hips have had more estrogen washed over them as a fetus. 

Your guy's understanding of his role as being a bastard is his way to compete, conquer and control. That's what a man should do.

That said, he is very strict about context and time for any meet ups ...coffee houses, daylight etc He keeps everything in a work context between us other than a work social get together once every couple of months.

I promise I will not allow myself to melt any more!! I was doing really well until the email earlier today. I am so glad I shared it with you.

I really think that this guy has the manipulation skills of a master! We all muddle through this with lots and lots of practice of rear view mirror extrapolation. But as for your alpha male, don't believe for one second that he isn't playing and practicing with you. He's not naive...and he gets to 'play' outside of his marriage just a bit to see whether or not 'he still has it'. Your responsiveness to his male energy has him titillated, it's not innocent.

Very wise words Fran. I will take what you said to heart. A friend of mine in whom I have confided also reminded me that men just bounce back after words/encounters and we are far more impacted by them. That is what you are saying to me. It is probably the case that the cost for me emotionally is far greater.

Yes... you are right. I hadn't thought of it like that!!! Bless you m'dear, I have copied your response to me as a reminder!

Fran, in the end, do you think, that a guy in this guy's situation is mostly about enjoying the feedback he gets when I react/respond ..ego strokes etc ..more than anything more substantial friendship wise...

I absolutely do. Here is a man, x number of years of being married, who is on some level bored with the safety and security of the woman that he has at home. And although he may love her and never dream of actually crossing a line as to have an affair and certainly not leave her, this little bit of titillation that he gets from you. Any meeting that the two of you have could be construed by any outsider as JUST work meetings but your 'stokes' offer him a challenge in ways that he dare not dream of within the propriety of marriage. He's being CLEVER in never quite crossing a line with you but indeed manipulating you just enough to have him fantasizing over him. He feeds you just enough of his bait to keep you hanging around wanting more 'food' from him.

I wonder if I am a silly female who needs to get her head totally straightened out ....

I'm thinking about old boyfriends... 2 of them were serious manipulators and turned out to be womanizers..I didn't sleep with either of them but was drawn in by the clever NLP tactics of one older man and the other had that 'bad boy' charm....

Then I found The Rules and that was a useful start... and then loads of learning etc. But I am clearly still a soft touch!!! This is beyond helpful and a wake up call. THANK YOU.

I was so tempted to go into work for the meeting I mentioned to you in the first email. I think I will use my genuine business as an excuse to stay home and complete my big project and allow a little more space between him and I.

It is very telling that whenever I get a little more matter of fact and busy, he always leaps in with some extra warm comment or is extra teasing... You are right, he knows how to keep me where he wants me emotionally.

I related to your story...so much!! He said I was like praline cracknell (do you have that in the US?) crunchy on the outside and soft in the middle. Thanks so much Fran.

Look at how Joshua--the man in my 'phone sex' blog said to me exactly what I wanted to hear. I had asked him in the very beginning what it was about me that he responded to...He told me that he KNEW that I had been hurt--but that I couldn't keep my hurt inside of me forever... (who hasn't been hurt???) He took a universal emotion and made it appear to me that I was the only person in the world who could have felt that way; and he was oh-so-very-special to have looked into my soul and seen in that [pain in me. Everyone wants to be understood for who they are.)

He told me that he knew that I NEEDED to be loved the same way that he WANTED to love a woman...look at how masterfully he tried to manipulated me with his seduction! But he couldn't get me to have phone sex with him...so like a perfect neurolinguistic /player, he turned up the heat with the great take away--either I was going to play this his way--Mr. Master Manipulator--OR he was going to wish me well by telling me 'how sad it was for him that I didn't understand him'. He promised me love--he took it as fast as he offered it--thinking  that I was so starved for love that I would have done anything for more 'love food' of him/from him... Whether he was a psychiatrist or just trained himself in understanding basic human behavior (just as pick up artists do), recognize that he he has a skill set that has served him in the past, so he went back to the well for another dip to use it again.

All of that Joshua bullshit was at the beginning of my Pat training....and I've learned a few things since then....like not to listen to a man's words but to watch his actions...(wink). We're all soft touches at our core. I also believe that it's true for most of us recovering yang's is that we're 'inside out'-- meaning that we're tough on the outside and soft on the inside--which is exactly the opposite of what yin is supposed to be. We're supposed to be soft outside and hard inside--the opposite of men.

The recognition of your behavior in this is also beginning of change!

I promise I will not allow myself to melt any more!! I was doing really well until the email earlier today. I am so glad I that I shared it with you.

You have very wise words Fran. I will take what you said to heart. A friend of mine in whom I have confided also reminded me that men just bounce back after words/encounters and we are far more impacted by them. That is what you are saying to me. It is probably the case that the cost for me emotionally is far greater.

Lol, I don't have any idea of what a praline cracknell is--but perhaps when I actually become the Queen of China perhaps I'll take a diplomatic trip abroad!

LOL ..you are a card!

Thanks for loving me--

Aaaaawwww.... the pleasure is all mine!!!
 
Finally, I am not saying that I have simply let it all hang out! I am very much in favour of strategic frameworks in dating. That said, I tend to mix up mine because I forget in the moment and act in the moment!

After all, there was nothing to lose so it was an interesting experiment for someone like me who tends to freeze up and get very anxious about dating scenarios for real... I am usually so anxious not to make a mistake that the whole thing stresses me out.

C., *IF* you have enough inner clarity AND can keep your head/heart from wanting him, I don't have a problem with you using him for practice. But do it as an experiment to watch his reactions--as a man--but not as a man that you can have. If you're able to separate out the two and keep the mindset of watching your behavior--just like you would on a duty date, then I don't have a problem with you spending time with him.

If, however, he's pulling at your heartstrings and fantasizing about how wonderful it would be if his wife were hit by a bus, then for your own sanity, you have to stay away from him.

Remember this man knew how to get at least one woman to fall in love with him and into bed (his wife). He'll know exactly how to do that again. He's not-so-innocently doing this...he's doing this (to you) because it feels good to him.

Some time ago, I had a man do, what I felt was playing with me and I fell head over heels waiting for him to make it real. I was with a mentor and I told him about the issue. I asked why someone would do that? He said to me was 'he's doing it because he can'. THAT'S a one liner that I've never forgotten...

I have to be honest and say that I probably can use him as practice and to regain my confidence. I operated with an odd ' C.' mix of playing it cool and being 'busy' and at the same time when we are chatting about work or whatever, AND being my full self and by allowing different aspects of who I am, my feminine take in things, my unique and quirky take on things, including when I was deeply upset on 2 or 3 occasions, to bubble through and by allowing him to tease me and give me professional support.

I probably instinctively used two or three different and slightly conflicting dating strategies to great effect. My own inability to stick to anything perfectly has certainly wrong footed this. His instinctive Alpha male behavior on more than one occasion has come to the fore and it wasn't even my intent. But that is also me ...I am not systematic in any part of my life....

I have also in the end started and finished what makes me tick what works for me. And it has worked, to my great surprise‚ albeit in this practice scenario.

I'm really ready again to face the dating world even if it is bumpy and disappointing. This is also because this type of guy would be right for me if he were on the market. The right type of guy is enthralled by the women we are and we end up feeling good about ourselves not because we perform perfectly but because we are creatures in which men delight!!!!

My one caveat here is that I need to guard my heart now more than I have done in the past. This time when I meet a guy who would be interesting to me if he were available, I had nothing to lose and practiced some approaches to see how they went. My guy is a totally self-confident alpha male and not going to be railroaded by a woman ...but I wanted to see what impression if at all I made.

I need to remember when I am back in the work place more regularly than I have been for months ( a project has kept me at home since last October and only going into work once or twice a month) that guys do not bond the way we do...I think my oxytocin bonding happens with quality time ..even if it is only a short work meeting!!!! So, I will be reducing any meeting time we have (and we are tasked with meeting because of my project) on the pretext of being busy or whatever......

The dating world and getting out and about beckons in April and I will no doubt have more problems than anyone else.

Have not been able to find a description of praline cracknell for you on-line (!!) but wanted to report on strategic progress since yesterday's VERY helpful e-exchange. Thank you again.

I sense that I need to initiate at this stage a subtle/smooth retreat. So today, I could easily have justified a trip into town for a very interesting departmental meeting (it is indirectly relevant to what I am researching) but I let it be known that I am playing catch-up (which is true) because of some last minute hitches with my research project.

So, I sent a brief, regretful but upbeat message to that effect about how boring it is to be stuck with all this work etc and that the meeting looked really interesting, say 'hi' to the gang etc etc. I think he picks up instinctively on resistance and when I appear to be 'floating away' ... and at this stage, I simply need to get my perspective clear as I create more space and more inner critical clarity as far as is possible. I will be in the work place regularly from April.

Have a super day and I am now head down in books and writing!!!!! It is raining and horribly cold here in England,

I am hoping that the next few weeks of absence until the second week in April, will help me to strengthen my perspective, so that I don't romanticise or mis-read his motivations, and then we will see in April how far I have come!

I loved the line about his wife being hit by a bus LOL!!! You got it!!! But I also promise that I will be honest and accountable.

Your one liner is very telling. I will hang onto that. It really de-romanticizes everything even more. Makes
me think of cat and mouse games, too. I so appreciate all this wise ammunition.

I suddenly realised that I actually feel quite hurt that I have been the object of this particular type of male attention. I also know that I am responsible now and in the next stage for my part and the way I handle it. But my heart let me know how it was feeling just now ....and it was feeling disappointment/let down and a measure of hurt.

If I allow the truth of that to percolate through my system for the next few weeks, I will end up stronger and with a better strategy because my clarity will be greater. Thank you, this is just sharing to keep me accountable. Bless you Fran!